Are today's songs unsingable by your team?

[Sigh_man]

I find that a lot of today's songs and the tutorials that accompany them (i.e. youtube, etc.) are in keys that are way too high for my average singers. I never hear anyone saying much about this so I wonder if it's just me. It also begs the question: if it's too high for my average worship singers, is it too high for the average congregation?

I'm not a voice expert but any song that hits a "C" or higher is pressing the range of most of my singers. Tomlin and other artists are regularly singing into the "E" and "F" range.

I find that I have to transpose a lot of songs down which of course does not always yield the best chord formations and affects the original sound of the song. This also takes time to do and I'm only part time.

Am I completely off base?

[chipshot0701]

I feel the same as you. I wish I had that high tenor voice! but alas!

[milepost13]

We've had this same conversation a few times here...yes, many songs are difficult to sing. Lower the key and move on. And, don't believe the lie that every person must be able to sing every note in order for the song to be usable.

Nate

[russhutto]

Some songs are too high, some are too low. Because the congregation is made up of all kinds of different voices, we just find the sweet spot and rock it. For us it's Low Bb to High D.

But what I do for songs that are really high like Tomlin or Israel Houghton stuff is let a lady lead it. It will be in the bottom to middle of their power natural range and it works very well.

I'll have our guys either sing low or a high harmony.

There's no rule that says one person has to sing lead through the entire set list. We switch it up.

This week for example, we're doing:

1) Forever (G) led by me a guy.
2) All around (D) an Israel song led by a woman in either the original key or very close to it.
3) Say So (E) another Israel song led by a woman in the original key.

I just sit back and rock the guitar, occasionally throwing in tasty ad libs and vocal cues. Spread the lead vocal love!

We've found that our people respond so much more to the variety anyways. And it really, really helps in training and equipping of others to do ministry in music. Every single one of our 7 vocalists right now have led at least one song in the last few months. And that was in a key that was comfortable for them individually, not necessarily for the entire congregation.

I think if we put more emphasis on just doing what we do with enthusiasm, intensity, and VARIETY it's ok if we sing a song that's a little high for the men, or one that's too low for the ladies at times.

[mikeymo1741]

We tend to switch up the leads as well. For instance, when we do Hillsong's Hosanna, we have one of our sopranos lead.

Most of the songs we do are either C or G, with some E. (Mostly the New Breed stuff) Sometimes we key it down. Often we tell the singers we key it down and don't, and then they hit it fine and go "That's much better!" :eek: It's all in the presentation.

I heard David Crowder once say that they play "O Praise Him" in an awkwardly high key (high Bb) in purpose. It makes people lift their heads and sing loud. :D

[milepost13]

To build on what Russ is saying, we actually have several songs in our list that use multiple lead vocalists in the same song. We don't have a true soprano to use for a lead vocalist, so our female range is limited. Also, we don't believe that everyone has to be able to sing every note of every song in order for our musical worship time to feel "successful".

Instead of trying to find the perfect key/range, we often use an alto lead on the verses and a tenor lead on the choruses.

By doing this, we've developed a culture within our church body in which people feel free to sing or not sing every note of a song.

Nate

[RiveraRa]

By doing this, we've developed a culture within our church body in which people feel free to sing or not sing every note of a song.


That's called dynamics ;)
We always stress that not every instrument needs to play every note or chord during the song. We must remember that our voices are instruments as well. Not every singer needs to sing all the time.

[Sigh_man]

I imagine the "lie" about congregational singability was a fun discussion.
:D I'll have to do a search on that topic sometime.

I tend to overthink so I'm glad I consulted some gurus like you guys
;) to cut down on my overthinking. Thanks for the helpful thoughts.

[jackb7]

I think we don't ask the question enough. Can the congregation actually sing this? Why are we doing this in the first place? We are lead worshippers, is anybody following? That sort of thing.

Case in point...Tomlin, Israel, etc.

I am doing a lot of Rick Pino stuff and we switch lead sometimes in the middle of the song to make it work.

[russhutto]

I think we don't ask the question enough. Can the congregation actually sing this? Why are we doing this in the first place? We are lead worshippers, is anybody following? That sort of thing.

Case in point...Tomlin, Israel, etc.

I am doing a lot of Rick Pino stuff and we switch lead sometimes in the middle of the song to make it work.

So are you advocating that we ask more and try and make every note singable by the congregation?

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and disagree if that's what you're saying.

If you've ever been to a rock show, or any kind of concert for that matter, you know that audience participation has nothing to do with the range of notes in a song.

There's several elements involved:

Energy: contagious.
Enthusiasm: contagious.
Confidence: sets us at ease.
Catchiness: the familiar and easy makes us comfortable joining in.
Fun: who doesn't want to have fun?
Mob: everyone else is having fun so I want to as well!


Obviously I'm not listing any spiritual elements because I'm talking about shows where there may or may not be a focus on God and an atmosphere of worship.

We dance and sing along at shows because it's fun. Everyone else is doing it. We're part of something bigger than ourselves, but also makes us feel good about participating individually.

How does that apply in a worship setting? Personally, I believe when we focus too much on the technicalities of "leading' worship and not enough on just doing it, we tend to over complicate it.

People respond to leaders who are confident and enthusiastic about what they do. If we get in front of people as lead worshipers and worry too much about every note our people can sense it.

But if we get up and just rock it in a heartfelt, passionate way, and do things that are fresh and varied our people will respond. To us? Sure, but that's where good leadership deflects that response to God.

[milepost13]

Ditto to everything Russ just said (and, again, we've had this exact same discussion here before...)!

Nate

[johnnysierra]

People respond to leaders who are confident and enthusiastic about what they do. If we get in front of people as lead worshipers and worry too much about every note our people can sense it.

But if we get up and just rock it in a heartfelt, passionate way, and do things that are fresh and varied our people will respond. To us? Sure, but that's where good leadership deflects that response to God.

You hit it on the dot Russ. Many times I have been told by people in the congregation that they were influenced to worship because of the way I worshiped. You have to believe in what you are doing and be passionate about it and people will follow. That confidence and energy will attract them and lead them. Like Russ said when you get caught up in the technicalities of leading worship, you don't enjoy it as much (I am not trying to preach, I am sure you all get enough of that during the week!)

Our worship ministry has done many Israel songs, for example, and most of the time it does seem to be a little high but I will either get one of the Altos or Sopranos to lead the song or to back me up with it. We try to customize the song as best as we could. When worse comes to worse, if we have to lower a song because it is too high we will push the song back for the following week to make sure that we have worked on it well.

[psalmsandhymns]

So are you advocating that we ask more and try and make every note singable by the congregation?


I'll go ahead and advocate that (with, of course, a qualification).

If a song is for congregational singing - it should be congregationally singable. The main "instrument" in our corporate worship gatherings should be the singing of the congregation. As a musician and arranger, my job is to provide the best accompaniment that I can for the congregation. As far as it is within my power, I should put things in keys for the congregation, I should make entrances clear for them so that they don't feel awkward and I should make congregational singing a joyous experience so that those who are not believers who are present will ask the question, "Who is this God that they love?"

If a song (or portion of a song) is a solo, or is meant for any group of people other than the entirety of the congregation, the congregation should be helped along to know what we're doing. For example, just like we have individuals pray by themselves in the service, yet they are praying on behalf of all of us, we have individual singers sing the praises of God in the service, singing with more skill, yes, but on behalf of the congregation.



If you've ever been to a rock show, or any kind of concert for that matter, you know that audience participation has nothing to do with the range of notes in a song.

There's several elements involved:

Energy: contagious.
Enthusiasm: contagious.
Confidence: sets us at ease.
Catchiness: the familiar and easy makes us comfortable joining in.
Fun: who doesn't want to have fun?
Mob: everyone else is having fun so I want to as well!


Obviously I'm not listing any spiritual elements because I'm talking about shows where there may or may not be a focus on God and an atmosphere of worship.

We dance and sing along at shows because it's fun. Everyone else is doing it. We're part of something bigger than ourselves, but also makes us feel good about participating individually.

How does that apply in a worship setting? Personally, I believe when we focus too much on the technicalities of "leading' worship and not enough on just doing it, we tend to over complicate it.

People respond to leaders who are confident and enthusiastic about what they do. If we get in front of people as lead worshipers and worry too much about every note our people can sense it.

But if we get up and just rock it in a heartfelt, passionate way, and do things that are fresh and varied our people will respond. To us? Sure, but that's where good leadership deflects that response to God.

I get where you're coming from but I suppose I have a fundamental disagreement with the idea that the model for worship should be a rock concert. (And I love rock concerts.)

[Smitty]

Good thread! I'm going to take some of you to task, though.

If the song is too high, lower it! Any guitar or piano swinging worship leader should be able to transpose...if you can't, practice, starting right now.

Smitty

[russhutto]

Great responses all around.

Lest my "rock show" example be misinterpreted, I didn't mean to imply that you should model your worship gathering after a rock concert. But I DID indeed mean to use it as an example of an environment where "corporate" singing and participation is higher than most any other example you can think of. More times than not, you actually have more singing, dancing, and general crowd participation at a rock show than you do at a worship gathering. Can we learn from that? I think so.

My overall point though is that instead of holding our congregations hand and laying out "worship" on a silver platter and spoon-feeding them every note, maybe it's better to present an environment that is rich in diversity and variety, instead of making everything sound the same across the board.

We do adjust music within reason. A lot of modern music is unsingable for SOME in our congregation but not for all. Here's a thought. If it's unsingable for the guys, let the girls sing it. And vice versa.

What I've seen for so many years, it that churches will have primarily one lead voice and then the same harmonies all across the board. Then ALL of the songs are adjusted for the lead singers voice and all of the harmonists are pretty much boxed into the same ranges forever.

But mix it up a bit and let you altos sing melody (adjust the range if you have to) and you'll have a whole new vocal range getting to join in a whole lote more comfortably.

Personally, if a tenor guy is always singing lead (no matter how "easy" you adjust the range to) it's always going to be comfortable for the tenor range folks.

Mix it up a bit.

I'm just sayin'

[fmckinnon]

Russ,
I think you are right on about mixing it up - especially in vocal range. That's why I love to see multiple "song leaders" in one given set.

[psalmsandhymns]

Russ, I get more of where you're coming from.

In our congregation, I pretty much don't care what the best range is for my lead vocalists - I pitch things for the congregation. If it's not in the best part of their range, that's okay with me, since they're not the most important thing - the congregation is. For example, when I lead "In Christ Alone", I can barely get the first few notes out because I'm a tenor and we sing it in D. That's cool with me. The congregation knows the song and is going to sing whether I can hit all of the notes in my best register or not.

Like someone earlier in the thread, I too try to stick to a Bb-D range. If I put everything in mezzo-soprano/baritone range, I'm making the most songs easily singable for the most people in the congregation. Even the highest tenors and sopranos or the lowest altos and basses will find very few notes in the Bb-D range that are unsingable.

[Smitty]

Russ...you rock, and as usual, you are spot on. Mixing it up is really the key to whole-hearted participation. I know from my own experience that when I have done that, been able to demonstrate to the team by giving the mic away, that it isn't about "me"; its at that point that real growth happens.

Smitty

[russhutto]

Eric, right on. You do your thing.

I'm not trying to suggest that your method doesn't work. It does and it's one I've used for 15 years of leading worship. Obviously, the church as a whole is who we serve as worship leading teams. It wouldn't make any sense to create environments which left them behind.

What's cool is you can actually approach this issue from both angles. Create a variety rich environment that also stays within reasonable ranges.

You see it would be one thing if everyone in the congregation sang the same thing. But they don't so it's very justifiable to mix it up. Occasionally going above or below what is "easy" for the congregation.

Some people would say that we should stick to the Bb-D range. I do the majority of the time. But if there is a song that I just really feel like would be enhanced by bumping it up a step or two, I do. People sing out and sing with more intensity when it's a tad higher (as opposed to a tad lower).

What I think most of us are agreeing upon is that we should be very mindful of not leaving our church behind vocally, but at the same time we should not be afraid to explore different sounds when it comes to lead vocals.

[jdmayfield]

Personally... I just man up and sing it in the original key... lol

[chipshot0701]

Personally... I just man up and sing it in the original key... lol

Some of us poor old guise sing like Waylon Jennings in his later years!!!
lol

[NLoomis]

I think an interesting corollary thread to this one would be for the traditional folks. When I used to sing in the choir ages ago, many of the hymns were too high for the average person to sing melody. I don't remember ever having a similar discussion about "re-keying" a hymn...

Nathan

[russhutto]

I would suggest that in more of a traditional setting, in years bygone, many people would have been slightly more adept in singing "parts" - where as today, most people aren't quite as skilled in the harmony department.

Doesn't mean people can't learn quickly. Every singer on my worship team sings harmony. Some had to learn some could do it naturally.

Bottom line. Environment plays a huge role in determining the end result of what we do.

Personally, I think the "man up" comment is laughable. The last thing I think of when trying to sing some of the high tenor stuff is "manning up"...more like, someone please kick me where the sun don't shine so that I can hit those notes. Not really my idea of manning up.

[Jay Tea]

I would suggest that in more of a traditional setting, in years bygone, many people would have been slightly more adept in singing "parts" - where as today, most people aren't quite as skilled in the harmony department.

And in general, I sometimes wonder if people 100-200 years ago just sang more as part of the culture, and had wider ranges because of it.


Personally, I think the "man up" comment is laughable. The last thing I think of when trying to sing some of the high tenor stuff is "manning up"...more like, someone please kick me where the sun don't shine so that I can hit those notes. Not really my idea of manning up.

When I read that, I thought, "I usually man up and sing it in the original key--an octave or two lower!"

[Trent]

I agree with you, Russ--and appreciate that you used the words "contagious energy." Energy is HUGE---HUGE. Energy, Artistry, Authenticity--that's my worship team's motto.

What's the goal? That's the big question. Is the aim to get everyone singing as loudly as possible all of the time? Maybe. That isn't the goal at my church.
Not that it's is a bad goal--depends on the church.

It's hard to explain, but I have been amazed by what my congregation will enthusuastically join in with if they are engaged spiritually and emotionally. Trust is huge. If they trust me and I've led them honestly they will follow me just about anywhere.

Different keys aren't just higher or lower. They are unique in sound and vibe. The "Hallelujah Chorus" is in D. VERY FLIPPIN' HIGH for the tenors, but Handel knew that no other key would be quite as exaltant. For my voice, there are many songs that if I key them down--they lose their urgency and energy.

I've never, ever heard a complaint that they are too high although I frequently employ E's and F's--sometimes higher on the bridge...ha ha.
I have a female leader I am mentoring who keys everything down two or three keys to match her voice. She leads every other week while I step back and play guitar and violin (not simultaneously).

That's my perspective, for whatever its worth. To sum up:
1. Don't lose sleep over keys.
2. Consider your musicians too...Eb sucks for electric guitar.
3. Be lighthearted with your people--if your church culture allows. (I actually say things like "this song is really flippin' high, you'll have to put your back into it." And they all laugh and then they sing like crazy!)
4. Be true to the integrity of the song. If the song touched you somehow, there must be some reason why--I'll bet it wasn't JUST the words, it was the vibe, too. (Don't you love Jeremy Riddle's "Sweetly Broken?" What's not to love? But how many singers in your church could sell that song? honestly?)
5. Be true to YOURSELF and YOUR style--you owe it to them. Nothing is worse than somebody trying to be someone they're not. refer to William Hung.

That's my opinion from my experience.

Peace,
t

[TruePraise]

our team often does have to transpose music for us to be ableto use it. I think this is because some stuff is written for tenors, i guess, and tenor music is just too high or low for sopranos. Or, the ladies have to sing harmony, which I struggle to do. Thankfully with CCLI we can get the key we need or our piano player can fix the key...

[TruePraise]

oh, and I wish we would re key some hymns, I am a first sop and good grief, some of those songs are really a stretch!

[skyescraper]

I have found CCLI's SongSelect to be a great resource for transposing any of the songs in their database to any key we want. I also have to rekey most hymns. I try to keep in the mind the singability for the congregation and the difficulty for the guitar players. As I keyboardist I don't mind flats, but I understand they are not so great for guitar.

As with hymns, I find that some contemporary music has a very wide - almost unrealistic - range; for instance, You Are Good (Israel Houghton); if you key it where you can sing the chorus, then the verse can be too low... Also, You Never Let Go (Matt Redman), Everlasting God, etc. but these songs have a lot of energy and it's fun figuring out how to make them work for us, with the singers we have.

[TruePraise]

yes, i think conemporary music is a challange for the average singer...but it is a fun challange....

[Sigh_man]

"For my voice, there are many songs that if I key them down--they lose their urgency and energy."

"if you key it where you can sing the chorus, then the verse can be too low..."


This is what I struggle with. Sometimes keying down just causes the song to be "flat" (not pitch wise) and lacking in energy (particularly the verses). It really is a hard balance to find. I appreciate all the thoughts...I just need to let it go at some point.

BTW, I paid dearly for several weeks the last time I told one of my female vocalists to man-up! :o

[TruePraise]

you should have paid dearly! Imagine telling your female vocalist to man up! HeeHee! They should tell you to try singing 2 octives higher than your range! HeHee!!:p

Seriously though.....that is the trouble I have with some songs that are so popular and led by male singers....it is so hard to get the key so that the "average" voice can sing it...but...with a team willing to work together it can work out....

I so appreciate female worship leaders with songs that seem to work for larger ranges of voices....

[Trent]

I think this is a great discussion--and how cool that there are all these worship leaders out there who wrestle with this stuff. It shows a commitment to sensitive leadership, so hats off to all of you!

Arrangement is important and several people have touched on the subject. I don't think that sopranos should always sing melody. I don't think alto parts should always be boring. I HAVE found several things to be true in my ministry:

1. Almost every singer that comes to me is capable of much more range than he/she is aware. A little coaching and a lot of encouragment can make a huge difference.

2. Just like amateur musicians overplay, amateur singers tend to over-sing unless they are given specific parts. Ebb and Flow is SO important to solid arrangements, but without direction, bands and worship teams usually sound exactly the same from the beginning of the song to the end. Altos will follow that melody around--a third below--like a trumpet in a mariachi band. The result can sound sing-songy and trite.

Complexity is meaningless without simplicity. Loud is meaningless without quiet. Resolution is meaningless without tension.

This yin and yang (yikes!) is crucial to everything from the musical and vocal arrangement of the song, to the programming of the worship experience itself.

But now I've digressed into journaling. forgive me.

trent

[russhutto]

I will second what trent is saying.

Maybe even sum it up in a statement...

Just because you have more than one vocal part (harmonies) available doesn't mean you have to use them for every note of the song.

[Trent]

Amen, Russ. You're so concise. I should filter all my posts through you first, save everyone a lot of time. :)

[musicianinthestates]

There's no rule that says one person has to sing lead through the entire set list. We switch it up.




unfortunately, in some leaders minds, and even non-leaders who think they know whats best, that rule does exist. It has to do with continuity- within service and over the weeks. Not a favorite rule, and I completely disagree, but I'm not in charge of the show here.

[TruePraise]

as long as you can tell who is "leading" i think you are right...one person does not have to do it the whole time...i think maybe sometims it is hard for some teams to work out the legistics of that though, and it is easier for them to just have one person lead all the time....

[russhutto]

I believe their should be one who leads the team, but there can be several who sing lead vocals.